Editor's note: Today, Chuck K., a New York expatriate living on the West Coast, drops by with intel on the outpost of Joe's Pizza that opened in Los Angeles. Buon appetito, friends! —The Mgmt.
Step right up! Get your honest-to-goodness, 100 percent original New York-style pizza. Whether it's Tony's,Johnnie's,Frankie's, or Vito's, Los Angeles pizza purveyors love to claim New York authenticity in their pies. Not long ago, an establishment in Marina Del Rey killed whatever optimism I had left for "New York-style" pizza around L.A.
At this nameless place, the crust tasted like a ream of loose-leaf paper, and the sticky, sweet ketchuplike sauce was smeared all over the dough. The cheese, well, we won't go there. L.A.'s generally dismal New York pizza scene changed for the better a few months ago when Joe Vitale of New York City's original Joe's Pizza opened a red brick storefront on Broadway in Santa Monica. The sign screamed to me, “Yo, how about a slice?” Was I dreaming? Was I experiencing a pizza hallucination? Would an alleged New York–style pizza finally taste like New York?
I've heard that New Yorkers deprived of good pizza for too long develop hyponapoletana nervosa, a condition characterized by sweaty palms, irregular heartbeats, and an insatiable craving for fresh mozzarella. Joined by a couple ex-New Yorkers, we cured this bug with Vitale's fresh mozzarella pie, which was as delicious as any on Carmine Street. So authentic that, for a moment, I thought I could hear basketballs pounding on the asphalt of the West 4th Street courts.
Anyone who has enjoyed a Joe's pie knows Vitale makes a firm, crisp, and chewy crust with no tip sag. Silky and creamy, the fresh mozzarella sticks to the slice and melds with the fresh sauce. Folded, the pizza makes that magical crunch—one that only a true pizza lover understands.
In addition to the fresh mozzarella, we also devoured a half-sausage, half-cheese pie, which was good but only average. A nice homemade fennel sausage would have improved the taste. The fresh mozzarella is the way to go. Probably because Vitale uses fresh Grande-brand mozzarella despite the price. For sauce, he reaches the same gourmand caliber with San Marzano tomatoes. The pies are baked between 500 and 525 degrees—not nearly as hot as a brick oven but hot enough for a perfectly charred crust.
Is It Really the Water?
Finally, I had to ask Vitale about the water. Does it really make a New York pie? In his words: “It's not the water. Santa Monica can be proud of its water.”
His opinion can be taken to the bank. The pie tasted like it had been sauced, cheesed, and baked right there on Carmine Street. What else is there to say? I'm going back over right now for a couple more slices. Vitale said he'll be opening more L.A.-based pizzerias, and with the price of gas rising like the dough in one of his pies, this won't be a minute too soon.
Joe's Pizza of Bleecker Street
111 Broadway, Santa Monica CA 90401 (map)
310-395-9222 joespizza.com
Hm. Can't say that slice is much of a looker. Glad it was tasty. Also, I don't much mind "tip sag" and would rather have a bit more sauce and pliancy in the crust than what it seems to have in the picture.
The magic, of course, is in getting a crisp crust that lacks significant tip sag while still maintaining the pliancy JustNancy talks about. Any monkey can make a crisp crust with no tip sag, since that just involves baking the hell out of it. How was the pliancy, Chuck? Could you fold it "libretto-style" without the crust cracking down the fold line?
I ran through a ton of NYC pizza over the 4th of July and just had Joe's in SM last weekend. The fresh mozzarella pie is pretty good and I've had about a dozen of them so I know what they're capable of there... but it couldn't hold a candle to anything I had in the city. Sadly. LA pizza is dead for me.
Well, except for Mozza which is a different breed of pizza, I still think Joe's is the best i've had in LA...Adam, it may have cracked slightly when i folded the slice but y'all need to understand there's no where in LA to get a decent slice so im grateful for any decent pizza i can get. I havent had a slice/pie in NY in 3 years so being able to pop over to Joe's in Santa Monica is a treat for me...Anyone want to fed-ex a pie or two from Patsy's or Pizza Napoletana , youre more than welcome.
As an Angeleno, completely concur that the Joe's slice is too cripsy and not flavorful enough. Vito's on La Cienega is genius and everything Joe's is not. Perfectly floppy/crispy, amazing flavors, amazing toppings. The best in LA (or tied with Mozza)
Ooohhhh that sounds like a challenge...ok LA Pizza Maven....can you get over to Vito's on La Cienega and give us your opinion on theirs? Is it truly everything Joe's is not??? I'd go myself...but I'm like...uh..3000 miles away...thanks!
hey fellow pizza freaks, i have been reading quite a bit about vito's,positive and negative and it is on my list for the next week or so..got to verify what theyre doin with the dough cheeseand suace..thanks for the word..
As a NYer living in Santa Monica I was very excited to have Joe's move in. The pizza was excellent in the beginning when he first opened but now the staff is getting lazy. Fresh mozzarella pie is going down in quality. it seems like they take the cheese out of the water bucket and throw it on the pie without draining. My last few orders of the fresh pie have had diluted sauce due to that. Also, the staff is less than pleasant. I was once given a pick up time frame of "30-55 minutes".... so do I leave my house to pick up your pizza in 25 mins or maybe in 45 mins?.... I think that's a ridiculous time frame for a pie - especially since they have no parking.... if the owner were there I know he wouldn't let that happen.
I live a couple blocks from Vito's and hit it up once or twice a week, Joe's once every three weeks or so. Depending on what kind of pie you get, Vito's is on par with Joe's. The white pies are better than Joe's whites, but Joe's pizzas with toppings are better. Vito's doesn't offer a fresh mozz pie. Both of them are Baker's Pride places so don't get too excited if you're used to wood or coal.
I had Bollini's again (Monterey Park?) and was more impressed the second time. They have a wood oven, inconsistent service. Better than Casa Bianco, probably not as good as Petrillo's if you live out there.
Finally, I went back to Mozza after a big NYC trip and though the crust there still rocks (it has to be among the best there is), I now realize that it's the so-so sauce that keeps it from greatness. Of course the majority of pies there don't come with tomato sauce anyway, but still...
Yeah, Vito's is not bad, Joe's is alright, but he is back in NY and leaving the pizza making out here to locals!! Nice move! If you want the best I've tried so far, there is a place on La Brea that just opened a few weeks ago. Verrazanos Pizza, the owners are from Staten Island, and they are the ones cooking! The crust is soft yet crunchy and the sauce is amazing! Easily better that Vito's for sure. Don't believe me, try some for yourself!
any news of possible pizza worth eating is a thrill...so, for a monday the weeks starting off hopeful of a moz,crust,sauce fix, thanks and i'll let you know how it was...
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I've heard that New Yorkers deprived of good pizza for too long develop hyponapoletana nervosa, a condition characterized by sweaty palms, irregular heartbeats, and an insatiable craving for fresh mozzarella. Joined by a couple ex-New Yorkers, we cured this bug with Vitale's fresh mozzarella pie, which was as delicious as any on Carmine Street. So authentic that, for a moment, I thought I could hear basketballs pounding on the asphalt of the West 4th Street courts.
20 Comments:
woohoo
YumNYC at 11:00AM on 07/15/08
Hm. Can't say that slice is much of a looker. Glad it was tasty. Also, I don't much mind "tip sag" and would rather have a bit more sauce and pliancy in the crust than what it seems to have in the picture.
JustNancy at 11:19AM on 07/15/08
The magic, of course, is in getting a crisp crust that lacks significant tip sag while still maintaining the pliancy JustNancy talks about. Any monkey can make a crisp crust with no tip sag, since that just involves baking the hell out of it. How was the pliancy, Chuck? Could you fold it "libretto-style" without the crust cracking down the fold line?
Adam Kuban at 11:25AM on 07/15/08
It doesn't look bad, but it doesn't look like New York style, either.
Kerosena at 11:51AM on 07/15/08
how does that NOT look like New York style?
Tenbucc2 at 1:52PM on 07/15/08
As a New Yorker who tried a slice there when I was last in LA, I can say that it was fine, but it really didn't hold a candle to a real NYC slice.
jamieforrest at 2:37PM on 07/15/08
I ran through a ton of NYC pizza over the 4th of July and just had Joe's in SM last weekend. The fresh mozzarella pie is pretty good and I've had about a dozen of them so I know what they're capable of there... but it couldn't hold a candle to anything I had in the city. Sadly. LA pizza is dead for me.
Lance Roberts at 3:28PM on 07/15/08
Have to think of a better analogy than "holding a candle." Let's just say it wasn't close.
Lance Roberts at 3:30PM on 07/15/08
Well, except for Mozza which is a different breed of pizza, I still think Joe's is the best i've had in LA...Adam, it may have cracked slightly when i folded the slice but y'all need to understand there's no where in LA to get a decent slice so im grateful for any decent pizza i can get. I havent had a slice/pie in NY in 3 years so being able to pop over to Joe's in Santa Monica is a treat for me...Anyone want to fed-ex a pie or two from Patsy's or Pizza Napoletana , youre more than welcome.
L.A. Pizza Maven at 4:51PM on 07/15/08
Not a great upskirt shot. I can't seem to see any charred blisters, and that tells me a lot about how authentic it is. Something is off !
Q80 BurgerBelly at 4:54PM on 07/15/08
@L.A. Pizza Maven: I hear ya.
Adam Kuban at 7:24PM on 07/15/08
As an Angeleno, completely concur that the Joe's slice is too cripsy and not flavorful enough. Vito's on La Cienega is genius and everything Joe's is not. Perfectly floppy/crispy, amazing flavors, amazing toppings. The best in LA (or tied with Mozza)
cheeseburger at 8:20PM on 07/15/08
Ooohhhh that sounds like a challenge...ok LA Pizza Maven....can you get over to Vito's on La Cienega and give us your opinion on theirs? Is it truly everything Joe's is not??? I'd go myself...but I'm like...uh..3000 miles away...thanks!
pjacob01 at 1:54PM on 07/16/08
Yes, agreed, please go and report. I think you will be extremely extremely happy. And talk to Vito if he's there, he's a trip.
cheeseburger at 4:15PM on 07/16/08
hey fellow pizza freaks, i have been reading quite a bit about vito's,positive and negative and it is on my list for the next week or so..got to verify what theyre doin with the dough cheeseand suace..thanks for the word..
L.A. Pizza Maven at 4:42PM on 07/16/08
@LAPM: Vito's! Go, go, go!
Adam Kuban at 4:59PM on 07/16/08
As a NYer living in Santa Monica I was very excited to have Joe's move in. The pizza was excellent in the beginning when he first opened but now the staff is getting lazy. Fresh mozzarella pie is going down in quality. it seems like they take the cheese out of the water bucket and throw it on the pie without draining. My last few orders of the fresh pie have had diluted sauce due to that. Also, the staff is less than pleasant. I was once given a pick up time frame of "30-55 minutes".... so do I leave my house to pick up your pizza in 25 mins or maybe in 45 mins?.... I think that's a ridiculous time frame for a pie - especially since they have no parking.... if the owner were there I know he wouldn't let that happen.
crysredd at 1:25PM on 07/17/08
I live a couple blocks from Vito's and hit it up once or twice a week, Joe's once every three weeks or so. Depending on what kind of pie you get, Vito's is on par with Joe's. The white pies are better than Joe's whites, but Joe's pizzas with toppings are better. Vito's doesn't offer a fresh mozz pie. Both of them are Baker's Pride places so don't get too excited if you're used to wood or coal.
I had Bollini's again (Monterey Park?) and was more impressed the second time. They have a wood oven, inconsistent service. Better than Casa Bianco, probably not as good as Petrillo's if you live out there.
Finally, I went back to Mozza after a big NYC trip and though the crust there still rocks (it has to be among the best there is), I now realize that it's the so-so sauce that keeps it from greatness. Of course the majority of pies there don't come with tomato sauce anyway, but still...
Lance Roberts at 11:18PM on 07/22/08
Yeah, Vito's is not bad, Joe's is alright, but he is back in NY and leaving the pizza making out here to locals!! Nice move! If you want the best I've tried so far, there is a place on La Brea that just opened a few weeks ago. Verrazanos Pizza, the owners are from Staten Island, and they are the ones cooking! The crust is soft yet crunchy and the sauce is amazing! Easily better that Vito's for sure. Don't believe me, try some for yourself!
jaynice at 12:32PM on 10/06/08
any news of possible pizza worth eating is a thrill...so, for a monday the weeks starting off hopeful of a moz,crust,sauce fix, thanks and i'll let you know how it was...
L.A. Pizza Maven at 3:17PM on 10/06/08