Slice - slice.seriouseats.com

Really? REALLY?

Osteria in Philly? Come on. The best pizza I've ever had in the U.S. is DiFara, and I've eaten Osteria a dozen times. It's pretty good, but Alan. As Joy on the view would say," So what! Who cares?"

'Pizza' makes me think of the Chinese language; there are so many dialects, most of them incomprehensible to other speakers, that a list of the best 'pizza' is certain to disappoint. In Chicago alone, you can have deep-dish, tavern-style, stuffed, neapolitan, as well as Pizza Hut or Domino's...they have nothing in common except bread, tomatoes and cheese.

Think of it this way...you can have a ham sandwich, piled high with thinly-cut ham, american cheese and yellow mustard with pickles on a fresh kaiser roll, or a panino with Jamon Iberico with Emmenthal and dijon...both are just ham and cheese sandwiches. Which is better? Who's to judge?

Where's Apizza Scholls? Did he not make it to Portland?

WTF do I start? How about with if Great Lake was so good, why didn't he have his party there instead of Lucali? Congratulations to Mark. Not only are you the Prince of the City, you're the King of the Country, Cuz.

The article reminds me that I need to make that long overdue ride up I95 to Beantown to go back to Galleria Umberto. And along the way stop at Al Forno in Providence. That friggin' thing looks awesome. There's way too much more to comment on in that article positive and negative, so I'm gonna stop right here and finish by saying that contrary to AR's contention, there is no dark side to pizza. It's straight out of heaven.

Ciao,

Paulie Gee

what is Co. Company? I thought I had been to all the NYC pizza places...oh well, something new to try

@foodinmouth & Alan Kuban - Actually there are 4 spots on the list given to Metro Detroit area pizzerias - Luigi's, Buddy's, Tomatoes Apizza and Niki's. The interesting thing is that there is a great story behind Buddy's pizza and a cross-town rival, Louie's. I dont know specific details, but Louie and Buddy started out together years ago and had a disagreement where one of them took half of their proprietary, specially forged cast-iron pans and started over across town! Both are amazing pizzas!

I live in North Carolina now and nobody understands when I pine for Detroit Pizza!!

Richman left Grimaldi's (Brooklyn, NY) off the list? He is a Philistine.

I suspect Great Lake would have been to small for a party.

forget the pizza. i want to eat christian bale up.

Where are the Washington, DC places!?

@gastronommeg That Jennifer Aniston pie on page one has my vote.

Ciao,

Paulie Gee

Richman is a victim of the "He who is without sin, cast the first stone." He rants on about pizza snobs who extol buffalo mozzarella, or about anchovies having no business on a pizza, then he dares to go on about some fu-fu places in Rhode Island (spinach and walnuts?), Philadelphia and San Francisco. He freely admits that plenty of people told them of their best/favorite place and he ignored them saying "No, sorry, your pizza is no good." Why? Because you say so? Come on! This is a "Best of Alan Richman" list, not a 25 best pizzas list. John Andrew Walsh is correct: Richman is a Philastine.

Sigh....Another pizza list written by someone who completely dismisses deep dish and stuffed pizza. Even with that oversight, I actually think Richman did some good work on this one - it was quite a bit more thought out than the nonsense he wrote last year comparing New York and Chicago hot dogs. That said, I can't disagree with what Mad Ernie just wrote.

@Paulie: "How about with if Great Lake was so good, why didn't he have his party there instead of Lucali?" Seems like you are implying that Richman doesn't actually believe his rankings. Saying things like that make you sound like pizzaexpert, and I don't think that's your goal. I think the most likely reasons for holding the event at Lucali's are 1) Richman lives in New York, 2) GQ is based in New York, and 3) events in New York tend to get more coverage since most national media is based in New York.

Erm... yeah, did he just completely ignore the entirety of the Pacific NW? I've not yet explored all of the pizza offerings in all of the major US cities, but I've yet to have pizza better than my 2 faves in Portland, OR. And yes, I've been to the major places in NYC. I really dislike lists like this ("Best in the US!") because it's very unlikely that *anyone* has gone to the length to hit up the best, say, 3 pizza places in every large city (incl suburbs) - it would just take too long. So these types of lists are skewed crazily anyhow. So be it, but I'll take it with a grain of salt.

At any rate, you got to believe that Great Lake Pizzeria will explode with popularity now. That place only has 8 seats. There is going to be an insane wait time now (even longer than it is now).

I just may have to go on another pizza journey to visit Great Lake. It captured my interest from the moment I read the owners were influenced by the man himself from the desert sun.

Bah. St. Louis. Ignored again. I know the provel has convinced people the city's the pizza antichrist, but I swear we've got good pies here so long as you avoid the ones who think velveeta is a cheese.

BAR pizza in New Haven, CT can hang with the best. Excellent pies. Maybe it is overlooked because it is a bar, nightclub and brew pub all in one.

Ciao, eh!

Good to see Tacconelli's getting its due.

What a strange list--wild nettles, broccoli rabe, and squash each carry their pizzeria to glory, but anchovies and cornmeal in the crust are too far out-there for consideration? I suppose the intention is more like a "top 25 pizzas in the US to brag about liking to strangers at a cocktail party".

there are so MANY things i could say but i don't think there would be enough space here. just a few things:
1) i totally respect richman and he seems like a nice guy but i RESPECTFULLY disagree with much of what he is saying....
...and keep in mind, these are opinions, not facts
2)he says pizza is not as big in italy as it is in America?
yes in a sense he is right...BUT we must consider that
a) since there is NO such thing as Italian cuisine, the other 19 of the 20 Italian regions have different foods so there is no need to eat pizza all the time like they do in Campania and Naples.
b) each italian town, not city or region, its own cuisines. add the towns, then cities, then regions, and you get the most DIVERSE culinary gathering in the world. in america, bad food, junk food etc makes up a HUGE chunk of our diet SO IT IS EASIER for americans to be crazier about pizza than Italians. THEY HAVE LESS CHOICES...and def less good choices at that. Richman even admits that pizza plays a secondary role to the other foods.
c) i really do not get the desire i see on this site to take a few shots at Italy.
It was done with the Ferran Adria article, and now this.
hhhmmm...i start to wonder, but i hope i am wrong.
3) he doesn't seem to be a fan of neapolitan pizza but then mentions a few that try to make neapolitan pizza as his top faves.
4) if richman by chance happened to like watermelon and meatloaf toppings, he would put such a pizza on his list. my point? these are opinions and i can find a different one from a different person for everyone he has.
5) he said we americans CARE more about pizza than italians.
if that were true, we wouldn't have so much of the junk that's out there.
I wrote in my wine book "Wine Made Easy" one of the most important lines of all time. I wrote: "enthusiasm doesn't necessarily qualify you"
6) let me repeat again i respect richman but disagree with his article.
we should all be happy we have food and can afford the luxury of picking favorites. 99% of the world is not so lucky
Gianluca Rottura
http://www.pizzaandcoffee.com/

Is the entire 109 list posted anywhere?

Santarpio's??? Ugh!

hmm, just glancing at this list before i dig in i'm wondering how lucali ended up at number 2. sure, it's very good but there's no way a pizza with that crust should be so high on the list. on the other hand, it's good to see totonno's in the top ten since so many people have been talking about it falling off for at least the last ten years, something i never agreed with.

There's so much wrong with that list but at the same time, it's pretty cool to see an article about all these places in a popular mag like GQ. This piece is really just what Richman thinks is the best places, not what the general population thinks; that being said, where the hell is Motorino? I don't really care if he doesn't like pizza napoletana, it should be there.

To say pizza isn't as important in Italy as America is certainly a debatable topic. Yes, pizza is very important in places like New York, New Haven, Detroit, etc., but there is a huge amount of our country that is the equivalent of a pizza wasteland. It's true there may be more places in America where pizza is "important" when compared to Italy, but in Napoli at least pizza is certainly as important as it is in a pizza-centric location like New York, if not more so.

That being said, pizza can be a highly personable and subjective item for review.....with personal style preferences often dictating which pizza is "better" than another.

Still, all in all you have to love the pizza journey he went on. There are a few places on his list I have not heard about which I need to try, as well as many I have enjoyed. Regardless to whether or not I agree with his exact rankings, I know I am looking forward to trying some of the places he mentioned. Now, if only Mr. Gee would stop yapping on this site and open a damned pizza joint, we'd really taste a masterful creation! :)

Whatever your ultimate preferences are, great journey Alan...that's one trip I'd love to take a ride on. Squisito!

@Pizzablogger Thanks. There are quite a few places that you can go to right now that I can only dream of equaling. However, when the time comes I promise you I'll do my best to make a good pie and be a gracious host.

Thanks again,

Paulie Gee

@nextgospel:
1) the jabs at Italy here are in jest
2) Alan Richman is NOT a nice man, in fact, he is a douche
3) yes, it is just Richman's opinion with the toppings as well as the list. That's all any critic's review is - one person's opinion. Whether or not you respect that person gives weight to their review or top picks. Richman does have a ton of awards.

Personally, I am not a fan of Richman and I can understand some people's issues with the list. But 25 places across the country is by no means definitive and I am glad that with the limited number of winners, he went with a lot of new school places.

And sorry Chicago, this is the Top 25 Pizzas, not Top 25 Casseroles. I have had some great Chicago deep dish but wouldn't call any of them "pizzas" :P

Well, I dont know how Tomato Pie on Melrose Ave in LA has been under the radar for so long,(it's been open 5 years) but I was there at the opening today, thanks to Alan Richman's review, and though I disagree with much of his "list", I'm glad he hipped me to this place. A more extensive review is coming but let me say it was excellent but numero 7(is that where he rated it?) is too high. Grimaldi's in Vegas is better than most of the other pizza Ive ever had.

@Pizzablogger "I feel once you cover/remove/obstruct the bottom of the pizza from direct exposure to the heat of the cooking floor, you have left pizza land and are somewhere else."

So you wouldn't consider the Sicilian at Spumoni Gardens (and every other place that makes a Sicilian pie) pizza?

Ciao,

Paulie Gee

@ Paulie Gee.

That being said, some places making Sicilian cook it part of the way in the pan and then take it out of the pan and finish the bake on the cooking floor.
To me, that would be a pizza, but whadda I know.

BTW, I whipped up a batch of your Lemoncello recipe last night. One just like you mentioned and one with the addition of 4 pineapple mint leaves to experiment with a twist. We'll see how it is in a few weeks. Thanks!

Gialina in SF is definitely great pizza...not top 25, but still very good. Eat it often.
Big snub to Apizza Scholls in Portland, OR.

Well, he nailed it by making Pizzeria Delfina #3. So, there's that.

Mmmmm... pizza!!!

Cheers,

~ Paula

I am glad to see that Bob and Timmy's made the list. I remember their pizza being very good.

@robert 40: virtually any type of oven is able to produce a char, if it is capable of producing a minimal level of high heat (750º to 800ºF and higher). Doesn't really matter if it is gas, electric, infrared, wood or coal....as long as it is producing a high enough heat on the floor.

Wood or coal fired ovens can imbue a crust and pizza with varying levels of "smokey" flavors that other ovens cannot replicate, but a char is certainly possible in multiple oven types. Check out the newish Baker's Pride Super Deck ovens, which can get up to 800ºF:

http://www.bakerspride.com/specs/SDECK-5736-01-07.pdf

Pizzablogger, Thanks so much for the info. I am in the very beginning stages of considering starting something up. But the cost of something like an Acunto oven is an deterrent. Apparently there are options without jeopardizing my kids college fund. LOL

Thanks again! I worked in the restaurant industry for years and even at a few nationally known restaurants. But needless to say pizza " High quality baking" is a whole new science. Knowing the basics without much more research is not something I would consider.
I often find it amazing how many people believe making pizza is a simple process. Truth is making Thomas Keller's oysters and pearls dish consistently is an easier task.

Paulie Gee, I been following your flickr photos for some time now.
As a matter of fact I've been counting the days to your PB visit likely as much as you have. LOL
Can't wait to hear your thoughts about it!

I cannot, cannot, cannot believe Jim Lahey's Co. made it on the list. Not only does Co. NOT serve anything even remotely resembling pizza -- I was actually offended by what I ate there.

How often does food make me angry? Never -- except at Co. This place needs to shape up, stop billing itself as a pizza place, or shut down like every other over-hyped flop in the city.

I've heard complaints about the service, but honestly, what it comes down to is the crust, which is thick and spongy. Pizza, at least in New York, and especially coming from a 900 degree oven like Lahey's, should have a cracklingly crisp, slightly charred thin crust.

I would have expected a world-famous baker to pay more attention to the most important part of the pizza, but no...instead I got wonderbread topped with too much arugula.

Further, putting truffles on "pizza" is completely antithetical to the idea of pizza as a cheap, delicious, utilitarian food. Beyond the fact that Lahey's product is neither cheap, delicious, or utilitarian -- it's hard to eat out of hand -- I can get a better slice of pizza at any Ray's pizza.
And putting expensive product on a bullshit slice is just gilding the lily.

Wow, eatup, doesn't sound like Co. at all... I have been there about 5 times and always has been great. Crust is thinner than UPN. Always has char.

Sounds like you have a chip on your shoulder, maybe sour grapes...

While I've devoted many hundreds of hours studying, baking, and consuming bread, it remains a humble food. Let's remember that most bread, at its simplest, involves only four ingredients, but, being a humble, simple food, it allows the baker's talent to shine through. With so few ingredients, a gorgeous loaf is produced through knowledge, experience, and serious talent. The bread is either decent or amazing.

Le Pain Quotidien's pain a l'ancienne is probably some of the best bread in the city. It's beautiful, with a glossy, cracked and golden crust that shatters when you take a bite. It's a beautiful thing because of its simplicity and because of its price: at under four dollars, it's one of the best meals you can find -- if you like eating plain bread, that is, which I do.

Virtually anyone can buy bread at this quality, in the city, for the same cost as, say, a supermarket loaf of Pepperidge Farms, or for less money than my fallback, Bread Alone. Even Wonderbread doesn't cost a whole lot less.

Bear with me, I'm getting to my point.

Bread is humble, bread is beautiful, bread is plentiful, and above all, it's cheap. Quality often bears no relation to price.

Patsy's uptown, my personal holy grail of pizza, puts out amazing pizza at half the price of Co., and while it's delicious, it's also a simple, utilitarian, no-bullshit, confident slice.

While I respect that Lahey and pizzaiolas across the city and the country are pushing pizza in somewhat non-traditional directions, I'd like to point to two things once again:

Real confidence in bread baking means creating complex flavors and textures with simple ingredients. Be confident: show off your experience, knowledge, and talent, and please, don't put truffles on a pizza to justify its ridiculous cost.

Don't try to glorify a utilitarian food that's all the more beautiful because it is and always will simple and humble.

Paulie, I'm hitting the Campari a little too hard tonight I guess....for some reason I thought you mentioned you were going to Philly for crabcakes? :)

If you plan on being in the Inner Harbor area of Baltimore, you might want to skip Phillips if you are interested in seeing more of an old school Baltimore crab house. Obrykci's, which is about 1/2 mile from Phillips may be a good choice as it is not to far away. It's somewhat unusual by foregoing the Old Bay seasoning in favor of cracked black pepper, but the crab cakes here are definitely better than Phillips. There are a few more places I would recommend, but they would require more driving and parking headaches than Phillips....and it sounds like you may be looking for a stop and pop. Wherever you go, enjoy!

http://www.obryckis.com/

how did Difara not make it onto this list?

Alan forgot to even mention midwest tavern style pizza...Chicago's true signature pie. This list is garbage.

http://chibbqking.blogspot.com/search/label/tavern%20style%20pizza

@Pizzablogger: There are way more than 7 pizza styles in the U.S. See: A List of U.S. Regional Pizza Styles

I'd really be interested to see the 109 pizza joints he went to. It does appear the NW got snubbed.

imo, you get to a certain level of quality and it becomes a question of palate. But prior to that, there are a lot of relatively objective factors that can be referenced along with traditional standards. There's an established language around pizza and some agreement within styles about what makes a good pizza. It's not just up to one man's opinion.

So it seems right that there should be some diversity unless he just wants to call it "Alan Richman's Favorite Pizzas". But, of course, that doesn't sell magazines like "the best in the USA" does.

We currently have 5 strong contenders in the Portland area: Apizza Scholls, Nostrana, Ken's Artisan, Al Forno Ferruzza, and Tastebud. If you extend down to Salem (45 minutes away), there's also a place that does an excellent New Haven style pie. The place is just called Apizza. All of these places use top quality ingredients and hot ovens. They all use long ferments for their doughs. Two of them have all wood ovens. Two of them make their own cheese (one makes a ricotta for calzones, the other mozzarella). I think three or more make their own salumi/charcuterie. Several of the owners were bread bakers before opening their pizza shops. These are classic pies with slightly varying styles, all falling in the Neapolitan, New York Neapolitan, and New Haven range, probably. But they're all just fricking good.

Admittedly, the offerings get thin after this with rather standard-issue stuff, though at least we have a decent number of places making actual pizza rather than just the chains.

But Portland should be on any pizza lover's radar and I have to wonder if Richman came here at all.

There are still a lot of places I'd like to hit. I was talking to a friend today who called to ask me questions about improving efficiency at Great Lake. Sounds like they really have a product they care about and I'm eager to get back to Chicago to try it. I still haven't hit Bianco. And I'm going to Mozza in July.

But I've been to a lot of the best around the country and Portland holds its own really, really well. I'd be surprised if there is any city in the US, except maybe NY, where the craft of pizza is being renewed as strongly -- ie, places that are only a couple years old as opposed to 100 years old. Is there any place that defines the next generation of honest pizzerias better than Portland? Prove it.

No lists for me. I make my own pies just the way I like them. No argument here, mine are the best!

People never seem to give Indianapolis the attention that it deserves. There seems to be a unique identity of pizza shaping up in this humble Midwest city. Places like Bazbeaux's, Some Guys, and Jockamo's, all have a similar style and delicious taste. The pizza almost feels healthy, not that they are. They are typically thinner crust with lots of gourmet ingredients. After growing up in Boston and living for many years in Chicago, I feel Indy gets over looked.

Pegasus Pizza in Seattle is also pretty good...although for some reason it sucks as a leftover, so be sure you eat it all when it is still hot.

tarry lodge is no longer, it is now a batali enterprise. the best in boston is regina

Come on ... how much talking about this guy ...
HE IS A LIVING CONTRADDICTION....
Less than a year ago he was mouth watering talking of neapolitan pizza he had in Japan ... Now he "destroyes" 300 years of tradition telling that Neapolitan pizza is disgusting ...
He does not like Neapolitan Pizza because of Buffalo Mozzarella and Anchovies ...
HALLO, McFLY? IS ANYONE THERE?
DID ANYONE TELL Mr. "ALAN McFLY" THAT NEAPOLITAN MARGHERITA IS MADE WITH FIOR DI LATTE and NOT WITH BUFFALO MOZZARELLA?
DID ANYONE TELL HIM THAT NONE OF THE THOUSANDS NEAPOLITAN PIZZERIA HAS ANCHOVIES ON THEIR MENU?
No passion behind Pizza in Italy ????
Is this guy KIDDING ME ????
Come on pizza in Napoli is a religion. There is no pizza without Napoli, there is no Napoli without pizza ... One cannot leave without the other ...
Mr. richman, give me a break ...
I honestly cannot take a Mr whatever to come-out with such a stupid article and throw 300 years of tradition and culture in the garbage ...
The funniest of all ????
After all this big article, he includes at least 9 Neapolitan (or better, Neapolitan wanna-be) pizzeria in his list of the 25 ....
IS HE KIDDING ME ???
What's it's point?
Can he be that stupid?
Come on, this article was a joke ...
One last thing.
Does anyone know where Mr. richman buys his "dope"?
That stuff is good, it works .... look how many BS he writes after he smokes it !!!! ah ah ah let's joke about it !!!!
LIFE IS BEAUTIFUL !!!!

"This list is very subjective and has been taken way too seriously."

@Paulie: Good point.

The crust Mangieri is making at UPN is, in my opinion, nothing short of spectacular. I do agree with bufala being a little too runny.....still, high quality bufala tastes fantastic....in my opinion. The flavor is the reason I am such a fan.

I wanted to set the record straight about Richman's top 25. The following is a link to my full review of Osteria on my Philadelphia best pizza blog, one of the only two pizza joints from Philly to make it on this list. A little hint: I was very disappointed. Happy reading!

http://www.bestphiladelphiapizzablog.blogspot.com/2009/09/osteria-philadelphia-pizza-review.html

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